Rhonda
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Post by Rhonda on Aug 21, 2005 8:25:41 GMT -5
Final view from about the same time.......late 1940's...shows house from another angle.
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nancs
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Post by nancs on Aug 21, 2005 15:46:20 GMT -5
Wonderful photos, Rhonda. Thanks so much for sharing. And once you get the 'hang' of posting pictures, it is a lot of fun, huh? Nanc
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Post by NL Hill on Sept 25, 2005 20:11:40 GMT -5
Thank you ,Rhonda, for the photos. I had asked you to post them along with more Irwin mansion photos in the Irwin home folder. I love old houses and it is such a shame that this one was lost. NLHill
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Post by David Sechrest on Sept 28, 2005 11:19:53 GMT -5
Nice pictures Rhonda. Is this the home that used to stand where the drive-up banking place is today? Also, for a matter of reference, the grocery store that was located in the 900 block of Washington was the old Standard Grocery. There for a while, it was used as an outlet center for Hostess, and now I think they just used it for storage. In my day (the 1960's), the old A&P was a couple of blocks farther south, on the same side of the street, approximately where Breeden's is today (at least that general vicinity). My copy of the 1966 City Directory lists the old Standard Grocery address as 930 Washington Street, but the directory doesn't show 9th Street intersecting with Washington. It lists 8th Street Intersecting, and 10th Street "beginning," then 11th Street beginning, and 12th Street intersecting. There was a street that separated the Standard Grocery parking lot and the building where Dr. Davis, our family doctor, had his office for so many years. I always thought this was 9th Street. Standard's parking lot was at the corner, then the grocery store. A&P's address is listed as 620 Washington Street, with it's parking lot due north of the building (and having it's own mailing address of 630 Washington). One of the earliest photos I have of a Crump home is depicted below. When I first saw this picture, I thought it to be one of the homes along Washington Street, just north of where the Standard Grocery was. But, I've been told otherwise. The above photo was developed on glass. If you look close, you can just barely make out a lake in the background. Someone has written underneath the photo that it is of Mrs. John Crump and kids. I hope some day to be able to identify where this house was located.
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Post by David Sechrest on Sept 28, 2005 11:30:53 GMT -5
Another "maybe." For some reason, I think I remember this house on the north side of Washington Street, west side, one or two houses north of Standard, but I'm not sure that info is correct. If anyone recognizes this home and its location, please let us know. The handwriting under the picture says My parents, Mr. and Mrs. Charles Crump. This is where I was born and lived until I was married. Margaret Bowman Charles Crump was one of John Crump's sons. By all indications, it looks like Charles and his wife, Margaret (Smith) had two children, one being the Margaret who wrote the info under the picture. By the way, the picture of Mrs. John Crump and kids wasn't on glass. It was tin.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2005 21:34:57 GMT -5
What a great picture David. The home appears to be in later years,1940's and 50's the home of the American Legion post. I remember the wrap around porch and went there when home on leave from the navy. I believe that it would have been the second home north of the standard grocery, the first home north of the standard would have been the Price home, it being in that family for many years and I believe still is in the family. The Overstreet home would be the next home north of the home in the picture. When I went on the fire dept. in 1958 there was a large home between the Overstreet home and fire station no. 1, the location is 11th. st. Have to think about your other fine picture.
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Post by David Sechrest on Sept 29, 2005 0:22:17 GMT -5
George, that's what I was thinking: that the house was the 2nd one north of Standard.
The Price home you speak of: was it a two story brick home with an iron fence? I seem to remember a home along that side that had an iron fence, but maybe not.
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Post by David Sechrest on Sept 29, 2005 0:35:32 GMT -5
I asked Jeff Crump about the picture of Mrs. John Crump and kids. He said he didn't recognize the house. I thought it might have been Francis J. Crump's home (John's father), which was where Mead Village is today. Apparently, when John and his wife returned to Columbus to stay here, he farmed the old "Crump homestead." No luck there...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2005 20:09:14 GMT -5
David, I don't recall seeing a iron fence at the Price home, there was and still is a iron fence across the front of the Overstreet home. George
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Post by Rhonda Bolner on Oct 16, 2005 11:22:15 GMT -5
Two replies for Dave:
1) The photos I posted of the Capt. Wm. Lucas home: No, Dave. The house was NOT located where the drive-up bank is today. It was located where the grocery/bread store building stands today. Pauline Crump told me there used to be 5 Crump family homes on that block. Only two still stand.
2) I don't think that is a lake in the photo you shared. If you look at the tree which is closest to the left side of the house, the trunk doesn't go all the way to the ground. I believe that white "stuff" is a fence. That tree is too close to the house to be across a "lake".
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Post by David Sechrest on Oct 17, 2005 0:35:36 GMT -5
Rhonda, you are right. That is a fence. Thanks for making me look a little closer at that picture. It appears that this folder is, more or less, turning into a discussion of the Crump families. I have the following to add here: Gottschalk Rite Saturday Prominent Woman, Lifelong Resident of City, Is Taken By Death Mrs. Mary Crump Gottschalk, 70, window of Richard F. Gottschalk and member of one of the city's oldest and most prominent families, died at 5:15 this morning at her home, 803 Franklin Street, after a few days of serious illness. Funeral services will be held at 2 o'clock Saturday afternoon at the Hathaway Funeral home, conducted by Dr. Alexander E. Sharp. Burial will be made in City cemetery. The casket will be open at the funeral home Friday evening and until time of the services. Mrs. Gottschalk was the daughter of the late Mr. and Mrs. John S. Crump, and was born and spent her entire life in Columbus. She was widely known and was familiarly called "Mollie" by her many friends. She was am active member of the Presbyterian church. Husband Killed Accidentally Mrs. Gottschalk was prostrated by shock and grief at the death of her husband, when he was electrocuted accidentally in 1907, and members of the family said she never fully recovered from it. Her health of late years had been worse, although she was able to be up and about until recently. Mr. Gottschalk was manager of Crump's theater, the Belvedere Hotel, and the Columbus Street Railway and Light Company at the time of his death. He happened to be going past Eleventh and Washington streets when a street car trolley line broke, and attempted to repair it to prevent danger to passersby. He came into contact with the trolley and was kiled instantly. Surviving are a daughter and son, Mrs. Harold B. Havens of this city, and Raymond Gottschalk; three grandchildren, Annette and Susan Havens, and Richard Gottschalk, a sister and two brothers, Mrs. Robert L. Ruddick of Los Angeles, John and Charles Crump here. The date of this obituary in the Evening Republican is unknown.
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Post by David Sechrest on Oct 17, 2005 1:18:05 GMT -5
Red Smith Jailed For Borrowing Car Started To Seymour in C. F. Crump's Machine but was Caught Webber "Red" Smith was jailed Friday night about 11 o'clock after he borrowed Charles F. Crump's automobile and run it out of gasoline. The machine was left in the road, a short distance this side of Jonesville, and Smith was brought back here and lodged in jail. Mr. Crump was undecided this morning as to what course he would take in the matter. Smith's relatives have offered to pay any and all damages to the Crump car, and Smith himself denies that he had any intention of stealing the automobile. It is said that Smith first made an attempt to start Dr. S. F. Kincaid's Queen runabout Friday night, but he is said to have left this machine and went to the Belvedere Hotel. Mr. Crump was in Indianapolis and his Queen touring car was standing in front of his hotel. Smith cranked the engine, jumped into the front of the car and started out. A short time ago, the night clerk at the Belvedre and a travelling man had gone to the St. Denis to see about some mail expected by the travelling man, and Smith pulled the car up in front of the St. Denis, where these two men were. He invited the night clerk and the salesman to accompany him back to the hotel and Jack Rush, sho was standing near, asked Smith to wait a moment, as he wanted to go to the Belveredere also. The three men got into the machine thinking the were bound for the Belvedere, but to their surprise, Smith took a different view of things, and hiked the car down Washington street, turned into Second Street, and made for the open country. He ran the car at a breakneck rate of speed to the Two Mile house where he stopped, and in a short time, he went to the Four Mile house. In the meantime, Mr. Crump had returned from Indianapolis and his day clerk, Jesse Brown, had informed him. Brown also said he had notified the police. Mr. Crump tried at once to borrow the big Ford touring car, owned by his uncle, Francis T. Crump, and on learning that he could not get this car, he thought of W. H. Miller, who has been here from Indianapolis for the past few days demonstrating a Ford six-cylinder touring car. This machine has a speed of from sixty to seventy miles an hour, and Mr. Crump thought he would need a high speed car to catch his machine. While the arrangements for the chase were being made, Smith and his passengers had returned to the Two Mile house, where Smith learned that a search was being made for him, and that the police had been notified. On learning this, he said he would give the officers a chase, and mentioned something about going to Seymour. The other people in the car had tried several time to get to return to Columbus, and each decided that he would escape from the runaway machine as soon as the opportunity came. When the car was run across the railroad track, just below the Second street bridge, it had to be slowed up a trifle so the turn into the Seymour road could be made. As the machine was going around the turn, the night clerk, travelling man, and Jack "unloaded." The night clerk, as young man named Matthews, who lives here, was scratched and bruised to some extent by the fall he received in jumping from the machine. The next chapter brought the Ford touring car into play and in this car was Mr. Miller at the wheel, Lynn Benefiel, Mr. Crump and Policemen Garretson and Carmichael. After going to the Two Mile house, they learned that Smith had made his plans to go to Seymour. The Ford car was then started in the direction of Seymour. A short distance this side of Jonesville, the party in the Ford car made out an automobile standing in the middle of the road, with a man working at the front part of it. The machine in the road was soon recognized as the Crump car, and the man was seen to be Smith. The Ford was stopped within a short distance of the runaway machine and Mr. Crump jumped out. "What in the world's the matter with you?" he demanded of Smith. "Looks like I'm out of gasoline," Smith replied. By that time, the other people in the Ford had piled out and were crowding up to Smith. "Well, we have a good car here," said Mr. Crump, "and you might just as well ride back in that. It won't cost you a cent, and we will gove you a nice ride." Smith climbed into the Ford and demanded to know if Mr. Crump and his companions thought he was stealing the Crump car. "I don't know about that," replied Mr. Crump. "We will let you tell your story to the court." When found Smith was poking in the gasoline tank with a stick to see if the machine had run out of fuel, Mr. Crump says there was about enough gasoline in th ecar to run it about sixty miles, but he thinks the high speed which Smith maintained on rough roads jarred the gasoline feed pipe loose and allowed the gasoline to run out on the ground. One of the automobile lamps was smashed and it is said that Smith got mad and smashed this lamp with his fist at the Two Mile house when he found that he did not know how to work it and could not light the gas. Efforts were made to borrow some rope and string Smith up (oops--it's late and I'm punchy). Efforts were made to borrow some rope in the country so that the Crump car could be towed into the city, but no rope could be found and the car was pushed to the side of the road where it was left until morning. The party in the Ford returned to Columbus a short time later and landed Smith in jail. This morning, Mr. Crump and Mr. Benefiel brought the disable car to this city and it was taken to the Benefiel garage, whre it will be gone onver and examined carefully. Mr. Crump first said this morning that he thought he would place a charge of grand larceny against Smith. Several friends of the Smith family called on him later and urged him to accept the amount of money to pay for the damages on his car and not institute any criminal proceedings. After having brought his car to this city this morning, Mr. Crump decided to accept the amount of money necessary to pay for the damages and as a result, he declined to institute any criminal proceedings against Smith. I don't know what year this article was printed in one of the local newspapers, but I get a real kick out of reading it. Smith, of course, had had a little bit too much to drink that night. Eventually, he was fined a dollar for being intoxicated, and a dollar for malicious tresspass. He paid his fines and left the courthouse. I find alot of interesting things in this article. For one, the way the car was described. Also, the Two Mile house and the Four Mile house. Then, the mentioning of Seymour Road, which doesn't appear on any of the old maps. It almost makes you think that the road the led to the Two Mile House is now 46, and Seymour Road is 11 (or 31A when I was younger). I have some other obits of Crump family members, and I'll post them at another time. I've got to get some sleep, as I have an appointment at the VA tomorrow morning! Good night!!!!!
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nancs
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Post by nancs on Oct 17, 2005 12:20:40 GMT -5
Aha-----might there be a skeleton in the closet here??? Hmmmmmmm!!!!!! Am not certain if the obit for Mrs. Gottchalk and the next post (Webber "Red" Smith) are from the same paper, if so, probably none of this puzzle will go together as I think it might. With a great deal of care in posing questions to my mom, as I didn't want to 'alter' her thinking process with which the dementia demons are capable of playing tricks with-----it goes thusly......... Webber Smith rang all kinds of bells with me----perhaps my great grandfather!!!! My Garland Brook records show his name as S. Weber (no two bs), BUT my mom spelled it with the two bs, no hesitation. Hmmmm. I quizzed as to a nickname------wasn't sure if she said "Web" or "Red," a spelling and it was "Red." Aha!!!!!! So we are getting close on this!!! My records show that S. Weber Smith was born in 1838 and passed in 1904, at age 66. Wish we had a date for the article. Know that he was a respected local farmer, and was rather 'hoping' this was more a youthful prank!!!! ;D But not quite sure just when automobiles were common enough for them to be around to steal or take a joy ride in, while under the influence!!!! ;D An internet search did come up with 'a touring car having 4 doors, and a roundabout having two.' Increased my automobile knowledge, if nothing else! ;D Next part of the article that rang bells was the mention of the Two Mile House and the Four Mile House. And somehow the Dipper Farm which wasn't mentioned. Know that my mom lived at the Dipper Farm as that was where her father (Carl W.) farmed, (see p. 38 of the Sesquicentennial book) which she tells me was near the Four Mile House. (I think I have a photo of her at the school out there.) Am rather thinking that this might have been an 'area' that was familiar to Webber "Red" Smith-----taking into account the current 'LA breaking news chase scenes' where the driver roams around his own neighborhood! ;D I do know a story about S. Weber/Webber Smith, in that he bought a team of horses of which he was quite proud. And drove them hell-bent down the Columbus streets (and the story was always related to me when we drove past the old ice house, so am guessing streets in that area). Apparently, he got quite a deal on this handsome team, but the family was not a bit pleased with him when they found out that one of the horses had killed a man!!!!! So, it is a sure fact, that this S. Weber/Webber Smith had an adventurous streak in him!!!!! Probably got this team really cheap, what with its history!!!! ;D And so my dad wasn't the only good horse trader in my family lineage!!!! With that-----would love any input that others might be able to add. This is just too, too much fun!!!!! Have a great day! Nanc
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Post by David Sechrest on Oct 17, 2005 13:30:14 GMT -5
Nanc, thanks for all the insight!
I don't think the two articles came from the same newspaper, but I could be wrong. Both were glued into a scrapbook I borrowed a few years back when I was doing research on John Crump.
I should have mentioned this last night, but the guy driving the trolley car in the article on John Crump is, indeed, Dick Gottschalk, of which is written about above.
As far as "Red" Smith, ha! It does sound like he had an adventurous streak, huh? No date has been written on the article.
Back in these days, there was more than one newspaper in Columbus. I'm not sure if this article appeared in the Evening Republican (The Republican, The Republic, or whatever you wish to call it). It might have come from the Star or the other paper whose name escapes me right now.
It's difficult to find copies of these papers at the library. While they have a great selection on microfiche, it is few and far between that the other newspapers are included. Most, if not all, are the Evening Republican, and whatever it was called before that name changed.
I'll be posting more interesting obits very soon!
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Post by David Sechrest on Oct 17, 2005 14:04:06 GMT -5
Since we've been talking about that section of Washington Street, west side and north of 9th Street, here is another photo: I believe these ladies to be: Nettie, Corda, and Mary Crump, daughters of John S. Crump. I suspect the 4th woman is John's wife. The only identifying note on the picture is "4 women at home." This home was the Crump home, located on the northwest corner of 7th and Lafayette.
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Post by David Sechrest on Oct 17, 2005 14:49:33 GMT -5
In The Miscellaneous Folder, there was discussion several months ago between George and I regarding the location of Francis J. Crump's Opera Hall, somewhere from where the SIHO building is, to just north of that location. Here is an interesting tidbit I recently "rediscovered" from that scrapbook of which the above pictures and obits came from: This article speaks of the life of FJ and it says "He made great improvements in Columbus, and was the founder of the bank which bore his name. He is entitled to the distinction of being the first banker in the county." This makes me wonder if, maybe, the above picture might have been FJ's bank before his involvement with the old First National Bank. I'm sorry, but that building just doesn't appear to be any type of Theater! (by the way, the location of the Crump building in the above picture was across from the courthouse, Washington Street side). Only speculation here...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2005 21:53:04 GMT -5
David, The picture of the John S. Crump home is on the NW corner of 7th and Lafayette Ave. The 1897 city directory gives his address at 704 Mechanic St. and his business address at 434 3rd street . The business listed were the Safe Deposit Vault and Crump Electric Street Ry. It appears that the picture was taken on the 7th street side of the home. The home does not have the wrap around porch today. There is a picture of the home on page 51 in the Sesquicentennial book. Hope you are feeling better, EC said you had been to the VA.
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Post by richard on Oct 18, 2005 23:03:26 GMT -5
Hi Nancy. On Monday, October 17, 2005 you posted a reply to David’s posting in this thread. With that post you discussed the spelling of Webber having one or two “B’s.”
I visited the library today and found the following information.
In the 1882-1883 City Directory it is listed as S. Webber Smith and living 1 mile East of Columbus. In this section it also had a listing within a parenthesis (Norton & Smith). I don’t know for sure, but could this be his place of employment? In the back of this book, I found a listing of land owned by Post Office. S. Webber Smith was listed as owning 332 Acers with a Columbus Post Office address.
George drove east on 7th street on the way home. As you travel up that small grade we passed Webber Street, spelled with two b’s on the street sign and then Smith Street. That area must have been his land at one time.
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nancs
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Post by nancs on Oct 19, 2005 7:41:43 GMT -5
Hi Richard, and all, Thanks for the info. Check out Misc. Columbus topics on the message board, p. 5, near the bottom. I posted a photo there of S. Webber Smith's home in East Columbus out on 7th St. Am just guessing that the date is incorrect, as S. Webber passed in 1904, but am inclined to think the people are correctly identified, as well as the house. And what you found rings true with all that I know. I have always been told that 'The Smith Addition' was built on his farm land, and that streets carried his name. Additionally, he sold a part of his farm to become Garland Brook. And at the time of the sale, S. Webber 'kept' his favorite spot on his farm to be his family's plot. Many Smith family members are buried there, as well as my dad. It is a big plot, and something like 12 spots remain. What really puzzles me is why the cemetery records have 'Weber' and not 'Webber.' As I write, think I will check the 'archives' for Bartholomew County and see what names I can come up with. As to 'Norton and Smith,' I have no clue. Think his only occupation was farmer. Thanks for joining me in solving this puzzle. Nanc
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Post by David Sechrest on Oct 19, 2005 8:03:53 GMT -5
George, thanks for pointing me in the right direction regarding the picture of the 4 Crump women. That house wasn't located on Washington Street and I don't know why I didn't place it as the John Crump home on 7th and Lafayette. I'll blame it on the meds. I've corrected my original post.
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